Interview of Spence Johnson, Waco, TX (1936)

^{Spence Johnson, Age over 87. Between 1936 and 1938. Photograph. Retrieved from the Library of Congress, www.loc.gov/item/mesnp162228/.}

SPENCE JOHNSON was born free, a member of the Choctaw Nation, in the Indian Territory, in the 1850's. He does not know his exact age. He and his mother were stolen and sold at auction in Shreveport to Riley Surratt, who lived near Shreveport, on the Texas - Louisiana line. He has lived in Waco since 1874.

"De nigger stealers done stole me and my mammy out'n de Choctaw Nation, up in de Indian Territory, when I was 'bout three years old. Brudder Knox, Sis Hannah, and my mammy and her two step-chillun was down on de river washin'. De nigger stealers driv up in a big carriage and mammy jus' thought nothin', 'cause de Ford was near dere and people goin' on de road stopped to water de horses and res' awhile in de shade. By'n by, a man coaxes de two bigges' chillun to de carriage and give dem some kind-a candy. Other chillun sees dis and goes, too. Two other men was walkin' 'round smokin' and gettin' closer to mammy all de time. When he kin, de men in de carriage got de two big step-chillun in with him and me and sis' climb in too, to see how come. Den de man holler, 'Git de ele one and let's git from here.' With dat de two big men grab mammy and she fought and screeched and bit and cry, but dey hit her on de head with something and drug her in, and throwed her on de floor. De big chilluns begin to fight for mammy, but one or de men nit 'em hard and off dey driv, with de horses under whip.

"Dis was near a place called Beggy Depot. Dey went down de Red Ribber, 'cress de ribber and en dewn in Louisiana to Shreveport."

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Down in Louisian' us was put on what dey call de 'block' and sol' to de highest bidder. My mammy and her three chillun brung $3,000 flat. De step-chillun was sel'' to somebody else, but us was bought by Marse Riley Surratt. He was de daddy of Jedge Marshall Surratt, him who got to be jedge here in Waco.

"Marse Riley Surratt had a big plantation; don't know how many acres, but dere was a factory and gins and big houses and lots of nigger quarters. De house was right on de Tex-Louisian' line. Mammy cooked for 'em. When Marse Riley bought her, she couldn't speak nothin' but de Choctaw words. I was a baby when us left de Choctaw country. My sister looked like a full-blood Choctaw Indian and she could pass for a real full-blood Indian. Mammy's folks was all Choctaw Indians. Her sisters was Polly Hogan, and Seekey Hogan and she had a brudder, Nolan Tubby. Dey was all known in de Territory in de ole days.

"Near as Marse Riley's books can come to it, I must of been be'n 'roun' 1859, up in de Territory.

"Us run de hay press to bale cotton on de plantation and took cotton by ox wagons to Shreveport. Seven or eight wagons in a train, with three or four yoke of steers to each wagon. Us made 'lasses and cloth and shoes and lots of things. Old Marse Riley had a nigger who could make shoes and if he had to go to court in Carthage, he'd leave nigger make shoes for him.

"De quarters was a quarter mile long, all strung out on de creek bank. Our cabin was next de big house. De white folks give big balls and had supper goin; all night. Us had lots to eat and dey let us have dances and suppers, too. We never go anywhere. Mammy always cry and 'fraid of

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bein' stole again.

"Dere was a white man live close to us, but over in Louisian'. He had raised him a great big black man what brung fancy price on de block. De black man sho' love dat white man. Dis white man would sell ole John—dat's de black man's name—on de block to somebody from Georgia or other place fur off. Den, after 'while de white man would steal ole John back and bring him home and feed him good, den sell him again. After he had sol' ole John some lot of times, he coaxed ole John off in de swamp one day and ole John found dead sev'ral days later. De white folks said dat de owner kill him, 'cause 'a dead nigger won't tell no tales.

"Durin' de Freedom War, I seed soldiers all ever de.road. Dey was breakin' horses what dey stole. Us skeered and didn' let soldiers see us if we could help it. Mammy and I stayed on with Marse Riley after Freedom and till I was 'bout sixteen. Den Marse Riley died and I come to Waco in a wagon with Judge Surratt's brother, Marse Taylor Surratt. I come to Waco de same year dat Dr. Lovelace did, and he says that was 1874. I married and us had six chillun.

"I can't read or write, 'cause I only went to school one day. De white folks tried to larn me, but I's too thickheaded.

Available at https://www.loc.gov/resource/mesn.162/?sp=233&st=image